tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4411161795798360588.post5209612476901123522..comments2024-03-26T09:38:39.888+00:00Comments on Borthlas: A means to an endJohn Dixonhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/07447224248021209852noreply@blogger.comBlogger4125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4411161795798360588.post-23841346531816736612016-10-31T08:04:34.884+00:002016-10-31T08:04:34.884+00:00Jonathan,
Doing a one-bill deal with the Tories s...Jonathan,<br /><br />Doing a one-bill deal with the Tories sounds simple enough, but as far as I'm aware, they're even more opposed to proportional representation than Labour. That aside, I wouldn't - and never have - oppose agreements with the Conservative Party if they met the key condition of securing significant change. I'm not inclined to the romantic view of Labour as some sort of radical voice of working people - they long ago ceased being anything remotely resembling that.<br /><br />THere's also a difference between an electoral deal and a post-election deal. One of the problems with electoral deals is that they tend to assume that the punters (i.e. the electorate) will neatly fall in line behind the deal so that the numbers come out as predicted. The evidence for that seems to be consipcuous by its absence.<br /><br />However, in this case, I wasn't only considering the nationalist position; the post was about the much wider question of electoral deals. And it was also in response to suggestions of a UK-wide, rather than Wales-specific, alliance.John Dixonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07447224248021209852noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4411161795798360588.post-4713974704905885532016-10-30T18:03:47.469+00:002016-10-30T18:03:47.469+00:00You are so nearly in focus....Deal aimed only at c...You are so nearly in focus....Deal aimed only at changes in the system... problem that the large party in question won't like it.....Let me sharpen the focus.<br />A simple change to PR is all very well, but fiddling while the Brexit fire-storm burns. The single change we need is an Assembly Bill to provide for an elected Welsh Convention, through a written Constitution. That is what I call change - unites Wales and takes it forward on an agreed basis.<br />That large party? Why must it be Labour? OK, we all like many of the old ideals of the Labour Party. You don't like Trident. I like mutual banks etc. But let's face it, Labour 2016 isn't like that. It is tired and dying, and blocking Wales by keeping the UK Social Union, not for the Welsh but to justify Labour's existence. <br />Do the one-Bill deal with the Tories, its so simple!. They have the same notion that Wales is staggering having to carry the near-corpse of Welsh Labour. They want an economic uplift through constitutional change - read what they write! They want to clean the Augean stables. Many of them are fine with devolution so Wales CAN muster a pro-Wales majority without Labour.<br />Would they agree, only on condition that its final, that Wales gets the rights of a US State or Catalunya? Wouldn't that be a quantum leap and wondrously better than what we have now? Take the deal.....<br />As history shows (just think Hungary breaking from Austria in the 19th Century) Wales could come back for more and take the final leap to full independence if it wanted. <br />Would this be such bad way forward, "progressive" in fact?<br />Jonathanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05937342201811857738noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4411161795798360588.post-3623449631552366852016-10-30T17:35:41.083+00:002016-10-30T17:35:41.083+00:00This idea of forming alliances in the manner sugge...This idea of forming alliances in the manner suggested is something I intend to actively fight against at every opportunity I get. The notion goes against the reason pf Plaid's existence. It seems to be tempting to some whenever Plaid, or the Liberals for that matter, are in a position to shore up Labour. Then they can't resist the temptation to be a minister. <br />But what about the constituencies at a local level. They have been working hard to make inroads onto local councils in the face of savage Labour opposition, only to be told they must stand down to give the Labour candidate a free run. <br />The evidence of any minor party going into coalition or even agreement with a major party has meant a severe loss of support. <br />I am convinced that Plaid should bite the bullet and firmly declare that Plaid is a nationalist party and all others are unionists. Enough of alliances, it's time to attack.Petehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02199538597477712978noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4411161795798360588.post-71576599115729057132016-10-29T11:30:29.743+01:002016-10-29T11:30:29.743+01:00Excellent post -you are to be congratulated as hav...Excellent post -you are to be congratulated as having observed the “happy-clappy progressives” in Plaid over the decades I am still at a loss to know what it means. One definition I have is that their answer to any economic /social problem is to throw money at it, without any comprehension of sound money or the wealth creating machinery of society. Or it`s a vague concept of all that is good and wholesome like American apple pie and those that do not like apple pie are the devil.<br />The quote about the nationalist parties accepting “devo-max” hits the point, as this is exactly has happened in Plaid when decades ago the English class- war warriors entered the party. They are locked into the English system of government in Wales and work to improve it at all cost, as they believe that this can deliver all that the Welsh people crave.<br />Difficult to develop this product when your articles of faith, namely the reason you were created and the Aims of the party stress that no outside government can serve a free people -hence the lack of focus, confusion and decay of the party over the years. <br />Spirit of BMEnoreply@blogger.com